Episode 64: An Insider’s Guide to New York City with Pauline Frommer

Angie Orth:

The gentle sound of the alarm clock pries open your eyes, and you give your body a good long stretch. Getting out of bed is a little easier than usual today because your adrenaline is already running on high. You've got big plans. The streets are alive and full of energy. You're up, ready, and out the door in no time. On your way to the ferry dock, the hypnotic aroma of fresh bagels steers you toward a busy deli. Now with the warmth of a toasted everything bagel in one hand and a hot coffee in the other, you are on your way. Today's agenda: Ellis Island and the towering Statue of Liberty.

New York, The Big Apple, Empire City, it's a destination full of art, culture, and history. And few know it better than my guest today, Pauline Frommer. She's written all about it in the bestselling Frommer's EasyGuide to New York City and Frommer's New York City day by day. She's also co-host of the Frommer's Travel Show podcast.

This episode was recorded live from the Dallas Travel Show, so you'll hear a little hustle and bustle in the background. Kind of the perfect soundtrack for a day in New York, don't you think? Pauline starts us off by explaining why New York City is the city destination that everyone needs to see.

Pauline Frommer:

I think the reason you go to New York—there are many reasons—we are the cultural capital of the United States, we have incredible museums, extraordinary shows, concerts, everything. But also, 1 out of every 5 New Yorkers was born in a different country, so when you go to New York, you experience the whole world.

Angie:

You do!

Pauline:

You can go to Burmese restaurants, you can go to Albanian restaurants, you can go to The Ukrainian Museum. There's just so much there in the city.

Angie:

There is. There's everything you could ever want food-wise and culture-wise.

Pauline:

Right. I think it's a very friendly place, partially because we are all on the streets together. Nobody drives cars in New York. We all have to deal with one another because we're all walking around taking public transportation, so I think that makes us friendly.

Angie:

What is your relationship with New York City and what role has it played in your life?

Pauline:

Well, I was born in New York City.

Angie:

The rare unicorn.

Pauline:

I know! That makes me very unusual. I've lived there my whole life. I've been writing the book for about 20 years now, and I feel like the city is my muse. It's always changing, it’s always interesting. I’m passionately in love with New York City.

Angie:

Why do you think New York City is a place that everyone needs to see at least once?

Pauline:

In many ways, this is where our country started. You have the place where George Washington took the oath of office as the first president of the United States, you have the place where commerce started in the United States, and so to understand the story of America, you need to understand the story of New York, and you will discover that.

For a broader everyone, I think you come to New York because a lot of other things started here like the Broadway musical. To my mind, seeing a show where insanely talented people are singing and dancing their hearts out about a topic that actually speaks to what life is about is a bucket list experience. It’s something everybody should do.

Angie:

I don't know that I even put together how important New York City was at the start of the United States until I got to be such a huge Hamilton fan. And then you really do, you put all the pieces together and discover Hamilton Heights and downtown New York, and what happened there in all the streets that have the brown signs.

Pauline:

And you go to the New York City Stock Exchange where they have this scraggly, ugly little buttonwood tree because the very first stockbrokers in all of this hemisphere would meet under that tree. To this day, the stock exchange keeps a little tree growing outside.

Angie:

I love that. So, New York City has been on the tourist circuit going back to the 1820s.

Pauline:

Yep.

Angie:

Why? Why have people been coming for that long and how has it shaped the overall culture of what we see now?

Pauline:

If you watch The Gilded Age on HBO, you see that the people way back many generations ago took it seriously that they wanted the city to be a cultural capital. So, this has always been a place that valued the arts, valued culture. People who are interested in drawing, painting, ballet, symphony music, in many other parts of culture, always came to New York. I don't think people realized how important tourism is to New York until the pandemic when suddenly tens of thousands of people were thrown out of work, and it really came home how vital the tourism industry is. And not only to New York, but to the world. There was a recent study that showed that 1 out of every 10 human beings on Earth work in travel. It's this major force that people think of as kind of silly and, “Oh, you're going to have fun.” No, this is what's putting bread and butter on people's tables.

Angie:

Yes, I think a lot of us maybe didn't realize that until COVID took it all and took so many people out and so many jobs out. Thank goodness we're back.

Pauline:

We're back with a vengeance. Our books are selling like gangbusters, I go to these travel shows—where we are—and they're jammed with people. People know now that life can change on a dime and they don't want to get trapped at home. They want to go out and see the things that are going to be meaningful.

Angie:

New York was really hard hit, and you see that on TV and you think, “Oh no, I might've missed my shot.” We didn't know how it was going to turn out.

Pauline:

I think a lot of people are worried that New York is still hard hit. Truly, when I was updating my book on New York after the pandemic, I lost a third of my hotels, I lost a third of the restaurants, but they've all been replaced by … Well, we still have a deficit with hotels. We don't have enough hotels now for the number of people who want to visit. But in terms of the restaurants, a lot of the young sous chefs are starting their own stuff, so it's a very young, vital culinary scene right now, which is really exciting.

Angie:

It's a good opportunity for entrepreneurs, and that's what New York is all about. Little upstarts getting in there and going for it.

Pauline:

People are still not back to work in offices in Midtown as much as they are in other places. Because of that, little delis are now turning in to restaurants. We're seeing a lot more unusual startups right in the heart of Midtown than we have in the past.

There's this amazing little restaurant called KJUN, K-J-U-N, it's a fusion Korean-New Orleans restaurant and it's in what was a tiny little former deli space. It's very a seat of your pants. Food is amazing. Before the pandemic, this is a place that would've opened far in the recesses of Queens, far from the center. Now we're seeing really interesting things happening in the center.

Angie:

There's a big cultural and economic shift that is still happening post-pandemic. What changed from the before times?

Pauline:

One of the most obvious changes is not a good one for tourists. For a long time, it's been illegal to rent an apartment for less than 30 days, but this was something that was never enforced. Now it's being enforced, and so overnight we went from, I think it was 40,000 Airbnb units to 7,000. You can still do an Airbnb if the owner lives on the property, but you can't if they don't. Because of that, and because a lot of the cheaper hotels are now being used by Mayor Adams to house migrants to the city, it's gotten much more expensive to stay in New York City. For the first time in 20 years, I'm having to recommend a lot of hotels in New Jersey just to make it more affordable.

Angie:

At least it's easy enough to get in the city. It's easy to get on and off the island, right?

Pauline:

Yeah, I'm only recommending those hotels that have really good transportation. So, you just walk a block and get on a ferry or walk 2 blocks and get on a direct train into the city.

Angie:

New York, just like its famously giant slices of pizza, is a destination to take 1 slice at a time. If you've never been before, you cannot see everything in one visit.

Pauline:

Definitely. Right.

Angie:

How do you break it up? If you're a first-time visitor, how do you approach New York City?

Pauline:

In our guidebook, what we do is we break the city into quadrants, and we create sample itineraries so that you're not having to travel too much and lose too much time that way.

Angie:

That's so smart.

Pauline:

For the first day, we say stay mostly in Midtown, go to the top of the Empire State Building. We think that's the key thing to do on your first day there because the city will be laid out your feet and you'll be able to see that it's all in a grid pattern. Then maybe dash up to the Metropolitan Museum your first day since it's the greatest museum in our hemisphere. You might go to the public library, which has incredible architecture. You might go to Grand Central Station and then maybe dash back down to Times Square for a Broadway show on your first night. I say go to Times Square after dark. It looks very seedy during the day. But by law, every single building that fronts Times Square has to have a certain number of lights on it, so that means after dark, it's like a fairyland.

Angie:

And that's a great way to start in New York City. That's a great way to start. That's a life-changing day.

Pauline:

Right, and the second day is all downtown. You go very early, get advanced reservations, so you can go up to the crown of the Statue of Liberty—you got to book that months in advance. Then you see Ellis Island, where the largest migration in human history occurred. More human beings came through this tiny island where they were processed by the federal government to become citizens than any other place on Earth. Hearing the stories and who got turned away, who got through, it's chilling. And then maybe you spend the afternoon at the 9/11 Museum.

Angie:

That's super important.

Pauline:

It’s an incredibly well-done, moving, devastating museum. It's a heavy day. That's a lot to see in one day, but if you really want to do it, you can.

Angie:

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For people who've been to New York a few times, they've done the Statue of Liberty, they've done The Met, what do you recommend they do that's maybe more far-flung, maybe not as easily accessible, not as obvious?

Pauline:

There are some fascinating neighborhoods in New York that are so much fun to explore. You could spend a day out in Brighton Beach, which is where the Ukrainians and Russians moved, and you just go from fascinating deli to deli.

Then you might go to Coney Island and see the rides and go to the aquarium. Or you go to some of the less well-known, but still amazing museums. There's a museum called the Museum of the Moving Image. It's a museum about radio, television, and video games, and the fun part about it is it's totally interactive, and you're out in Queens, so you might go to an ethnic restaurant for lunch, maybe an Egyptian one, maybe a Greek one. The number 7 train is considered a historic byway because it goes through this community that has people from all over the world and all corners of the globe. It's mind-boggling.

Angie:

There are so many museums. In 5 years that I lived there, I didn't even come close to touching all of them.

Pauline:

There aren’t only museums, there are also art galleries. There are more art galleries in New York City than anywhere else on the planet. The fun thing about art galleries is they're free to visit. There's an Instagram account, this woman calls herself the “thirstygallerina,” and she lists when they're having opening parties that anybody can go to. So, you go to these galleries and you get a free glass of wine and you're walking around and seeing the art for free.

Angie:

I don't think you can live anywhere else and just walk out your door and have an adventure you never planned for that day. You just never know what you're going to come across, if it's a gallery show or shenanigans. I used to remember the street food festival.

Pauline:

There's something called the Queens Night Market that is very much like the night markets you have in Asia, where you have literally hundreds of different vendors selling foods from all around the world, and they're in little bite-sized sampling sizes. So, you pay maybe $3 for pupusas from Ecuador and $4 for kebabs from Uzbekistan. It's just great.

Angie:

What do you think are the 3 most important travel tips you'd recommend for visitors

Pauline:

When you book a hotel, get a reservation you can cancel because inevitably prices will drop within a couple of days before travel. Usually, you can make a reservation you can cancel within 48 hours. That's a good way to save money.

Consider getting a sightseeing pass if you're going to see several things. Those can save you money.

Don't feel like you're going to have to splurge on every meal. Our pizza is great, our bagels are great, you can have an amazing meal without paying an arm and a leg. Although, maybe saving up enough money for one really special meal is a good thing to do, too because we have real artists in the kitchen in New York.

Angie:

Do you think the MetroCard is easy to use for a beginner? Would you recommend people take the subway?

Pauline:

You can just use your phone or your credit card. You don't need a MetroCard anymore. It's so easy. The way I get everywhere is I bike, and there is a bike-sharing system where you can pay, I think it's maybe $10 a day or something like that. There are lanes now that are blocked off, and so I feel pretty safe biking.

Angie:

Is it pretty easy then to get around with public transportation, even for somebody from Smalltown, USA who's never been anywhere?

Pauline:

For the vast majority of people, it’s so easy in Manhattan, which is where most tourists will spend the lion's share of their time, simply because that's where most the museums are. As I said earlier, it's on a grid system, so it's really not hard to figure out. You go uptown, you go downtown. Fifth Avenue cuts the city in half, so if you're east of Fifth Avenue, it's east. If it's west, it's west.

Angie:

Are there other accommodation options people should consider to save money?

Pauline:

If you can come in January, February, or early March, you will pay literally 50% of what you will pay at other times of the year.

Angie:

That's because it's cold. That's because January can be really cold.

Pauline:

Not always though! Lately, it hasn't been that cold.

Angie:

No, it's true. It's been quite mild the last few years I've been there in January. It's been pleasant.

Pauline:

And most of what you do and see in New York is indoors anyway.

Angie:

What are some of the most exciting things happening in New York City in 2024?

Pauline:

There are going to be more shows and musicals opening on Broadway than have happened in something like 20 years. The Great White Way is getting 20 new shows in 2024. It's a bonanza for visitors because those shows are going to have to discount to get people into those seats.

The Frick museum—which is one of my favorite museums in the city—is in the former mansion of Henry Clay Frick, who was a Gilded Age barren of industry. It just underwent a massive restoration, so it will be reopening in the fall and I think it's going to look more beautiful than ever. I'm hearing about all kinds of special events there.

The Museum of Natural History just recently opened a new building that I think has made the space a full quarter larger. And it deals with a lot of today's issues, a lot of things surrounding climate change, really incredibly interactive exhibits.

Angie:

I always loved visiting that even if you don't have time to see everything, it's worth walking through some of these bigger museums and just being there.

Pauline:

They have really good tours included with the cost of admission that are run by volunteers. I once took a tour with a retired dentist who took me to different parts of the museum and was discussing them by way of the teeth of what you were seeing. It was one of the most fascinating tours I've ever been to.

Angie:

There's so much to learn! Isn't that how you figure out where your passions are when you're younger? By listening to other people outside of your bubble. Next thing you know, you're an anthropological dentist.

Pauline:

I once heard that the secret to happiness was to create an area of expertise and then share it with others. And in sharing it, there's incredible joy.

Angie:

There is!

Pauline:

And that's my relationship to New York.

Angie:

Love to share about New York City with visitors. I want to know what is the perfect day for Pauline?

Pauline:

It would be fall. Fall in the city is so beautiful when the trees are changing. It might start with brunch with friends somewhere fun, and then maybe a stroll through Central Park. I love Central Park. Then maybe an afternoon at the Guggenheim or The Met or whatever has an interesting new exhibit. And then maybe a blowout dinner at a hot new restaurant—that also is problematic in New York—getting reservations has become a blood sport.

Angie:

Oh no.

Pauline:

I've heard that traders on Wall Street trade reservations with one another. In fact, there are websites where you pay to get a reservation, which I think is obscene. When you get a reservation at a hot spot, it just feels like a triumph. So, on my perfect day, I got that reservation and I'm getting to eat there, and it doesn't disappoint.

And then maybe I'd go to a show at Caveat, it's this really cool comedy club where the comedy isn't just standup comedians, it's more intellectual. They get like emergency room doctors to talk about the funniest things that ever happened, or they have linguists talking about weird words for an hour.

Angie:

That's fun.

Pauline:

Yeah, it's an interesting place.

Angie:

That's what I love about New York, you never know what you're going to stumble upon.

Pauline Frommer, thank you for joining us, and thank you to our listeners for being with us. If you're planning a trip, be sure to connect with a AAA Travel Advisor, check out AAA.com/Travel, or visit your local branch.

This podcast is a production of Auto Club Enterprises. If you enjoyed it, please subscribe, and leave us a review. I'm Angie Orth, thank you for traveling with AAA.